Although they may call it different things and approach its attainment in different ways, many of the world’s religions and philosophies have a similar goal: achieving a life of virtue, peace, and flourishing.
In his new book, Seriously Happy, Ben Aldrige explains how anyone can use the wisdom of ancient traditions to improve themselves and live the Good life. Today on the show, Ben offers a thumbnail sketch of Buddhism, Cynicism, Taoism, Stoicism, Epicureanism, and Aristotelianism, along with practices and challenges inspired by these philosophies, including walking a banana, listening to a music performance without music, and taking a Wu Wei adventure, that you can use to put ancient wisdom into action and become a better and happier man.
Resources Related to the Podcast
- Ben’s previous appearance on the AoM podcast: Episode #640 — Weird and Wonderful Ways to Get Comfortable Being Uncomfortable
- AoM Podcast #148: Trying Not to Try
- Why Buddhism is True: The Science and Philosophy of Meditation and Enlightenment by Robert Wright
- John Cage’s 4’33”
- Albert Ellis’ Rational Emotive Behavior Therapy
Connect With Ben Aldridge
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Read the Transcript
Brett McKay: Brett McKay here and welcome to another edition of the Art of Manliness podcast. Although they may call it different things and approaches attainment in different ways, many of the world’s religions and philosophies have a similar goal, achieving the life of virtue peace and flourishing. In his new book, Seriously Happy Ben Aldridge explains how anyone can use the wisdom of ancient traditions to prove themselves and live the good life. Taking the show, Ben offers a thumbnail sketch of Buddhism, cynicism, Taoism, stoicism, Epicureanism, and Aristotelian, along with practices and challenges inspired by these philosophies, including walking a banana, listening to a music performance without music, and taking a woo way adventure that you can use to put ancient wisdom into action and become a better and happier man after the show’s over. Check at our show notes at aom.is/seriouslyhappy. All right, Ben Aldridge, welcome back to the show.
Ben Aldridge: Hey, Brett, thank you so much for having me back. It’s an honor to be here again.
Brett McKay: So we had you on the show a few years ago to talk about your book, How to be Comfortable with Being Uncomfortable, and you got a new book out entitled Seriously Happy. So your previous book, How to be Comfortable with Being Uncomfortable, you took the Philosophy of Stoicism and try to find actual practices that people can do to put the philosophy into action. And what I love, we got this new book, even though it’s geared towards teenagers, I got a lot out of it. You take a look at different philosophies from around the world and across time and also try to extract actual practices you can do to put that philosophy into action. Let’s start off with the title of the book. It’s called Seriously Happy, how are You Defining Happiness in this book?
Ben Aldridge: So yeah, we look at happiness from a slightly different perspective in this book. So I’m going back to ancient Greece and the ancient Greeks had a fantastic take on happiness and this is really the core driving theme throughout the book. And the Greeks, the ancient Greeks, had this concept called eudaimonia. And this is very different from happiness in the modern world. I find that when we look around, we see a conditional happiness in the modern world. I’ll be happy when, I’ll be happy if, when I get the new house, the new job, the new car, et cetera. And the ancient Greeks had a different take. They wanted to achieve this thing called eudaimonia, which is a life that flows a flourishing life. And it’s a happiness that’s built on essentially building character and learning how to thrive, irrespective of what happens to us. And I think this is a great way to frame happiness because then it’s not external. We don’t need conditions to be happy because whatever happens, we are basically building character. So this is, I think it’s a nice way of framing happiness. And throughout the book we look at different philosophies and how they can help build character and ultimately achieve this elusive but very practical eudaimonia.
Brett McKay: Yeah, I like the idea of happiness being flourishing because yeah, I think a lot of times when we think about happiness in the modern day, we think of happiness is a feeling, but feelings are fleeting. Emotions are fleeting. You can feel good one moment for just random reasons, and then the next moment you’re just feeling like, ah, like crap. And you can’t figure out why it is. And so you’re constantly trying to chase that feeling. And as you said it, because it’s conditional upon your feelings, you’re never feeling like a constant state of happiness.
Ben Aldridge: For sure. And I think trying to achieve that is unrealistic. We can’t do that. We’re going to be feeling lots of different things throughout our lives. We’re gonna have high moments and low moments. And this is why the ancient Greeks had this concept of eudaimonia because it can apply to whatever situation we find ourselves in. And that’s very liberating. And we’re not trapped on just always chasing the next endorphin rush or dopamine hit. So it’s very practical.
Brett McKay: Yeah, I love that idea. And what’s interesting too, if you look across different philosophies from around the world, they also, they had different names for it, but they were trying to seek the same thing with their philosophies. This sort of state of flourishing where it’s not contingent upon your emotions, it’s contingent upon your character. So let’s dig into some of these philosophies that can help us obtain this state of flourishing, this eudaimonia. And you include Buddhism in your book, and Buddhism is a philosophy/religion. What are the big ideas from Buddhism you highlight in the book?
Ben Aldridge: So yeah, this is a big one and there’s a lot, obviously a lot to say about it. Many different Buddhist sects as well, and so many different types of Buddhism. But generalizing, there’s this foundational concept in Buddhism called the four Noble Truths. And what it’s highlighting is that life is gonna be tough, so life is suffering. So that’s the first noble truth. The second one is that our mind is the reason that we suffer the way that we frame things, causes a lot of problems for us. The third truth is that we can change our relationship to suffering. So good news, we can actually do something about it. And then the fourth noble truth is basically the method and there’s an eightfold path that Buddhism tends to recommend. And it’s things like meditating and living in the right way in alignment with moderation and various things.
So that’s the big take home is knowing the, the mind and the way that we frame things is the cause for a lot of problems in life. And of course, this is very top level and I know that, the lots of Buddhist scholars will have various different interpretations, but the four noble truths are really at the center of a lot of, Buddhist thinking. And actually a lot of modern psychology taps into this and uses this concept. And there’s a fantastic book called Why Buddhism is True by Robert Wright. And this really looks at the psychological side of Buddhism and it talks about how these ideas can help us to develop clear thinking. So I think really that’s one of the beautiful things about Buddhism. It’s a way of life. That’s it. Incredibly practical.
Brett McKay: You mentioned there are different sex or, schools of Buddhism, and one of them you talk about specifically in the book is Zen Buddhism. Tell us about zen.
Ben Aldridge: So zen is a lovely philosophy. Now, the little disclaimer before I start, I’m not a Zen Buddhist myself, but I’m a huge fan of these ideas and I deeply appreciate and love what they have put out into the world. So zen is a type of Buddhism and it’s pretty much a Japanese aesthetic type of Buddhism. So when we go to Japan and we look at the Japanese temples, we see minimalism throughout the way that they’ve been constructed with the beautiful zen gardens, which are often very empty with rocks placed in certain locations to help us relax and connect to deeper meanings as well. So it’s a type of Buddhism. And the ultimate goal of Zen is ultimately to help us achieve what they call it enlightenment. And that’s always a tricky word because I think for a lot of people they can get caught up in what does that mean and how do we achieve it?
But really it’s being able to understand the nature of reality and understand the nature of our mind and to be able to work with that. So knowing that suffering is something that we all face, but we can transcend that through training. And in Zen, one of the key things that they encourage is meditation. And that’s a great way to learn to control the minds in a very practical way. And it’s a very helpful tool for a lot of people. And you don’t need to be a zen Buddhist to be able to use this idea.
Brett McKay: Well, and I think a lot of people when they think of meditation, they think of sitting still on a mat and focusing on calming your thoughts and breath. And that is a practice. But you also recommend doing something called a moving meditation. What’s a moving meditation?
Ben Aldridge: Yeah, so in some zen temples, there’s a type of meditation where everyone will walk around the room in like a conga line, really. And they’re essentially trying to stay focused on the present moment, even though they’re moving. And actually this is done as a way to have some relief from long meditation sessions. ’cause often you’re sat down for hours and hours in these zen temples. So actually being able to break away from that and move means that you’re not gonna be in physical pain. And actually then you can focus on the present moment. So it’s something that we can use throughout our lives when we’re driving, when we’re walking to the shops, if we can actually just pay attention to the movement itself and the feeling of moving through space. And I think that can help us to, connect to this idea and this powerful meditation ultimately, which is gonna help us to control our racing thoughts and overthinking minds.
Brett McKay: That reminds me of labyrinths and that’s a form of meditations. You see these some places like I think monasteries might have them, churches might have them. We actually, there’s a labyrinth in a park just down the street from my house. And yeah, it’s just sort of this like maze, you kind of circle through and as you walk along this path, you’re supposed to meditate. And I’ve done it before. It is surprisingly relaxing.
Ben Aldridge: Yeah. And I think the thing is though, is hard at first when you first try and not think about stuff, it’s almost impossible to do that. But its, the repeated use of this skill helps to sharpen the mind and you do get better at it. So that can convert to walking meditation or when you’re just sort of present in your day-to-day life. But it also helps when you are actually practicing meditation when you’re sat down and you’re trying to focus on your breath or just trying to, stay with the moment rather than get caught up in all this overthinking. So yeah, it’s a great one, but I think it does take a little bit of time to feel the benefits and to actually start getting that stillness with the mind. ’cause it’s, our minds are so overactive.
Brett McKay: Another practice you recommend inspired by Zen, you call it the 4′33″ project. What is that?
Ben Aldridge: Oh, yes, I love this. There’s a man called John Cage and he was, an American composer and he loved Zen Buddhism and he used to hang out with Zen masters and he meditated a lot. He wasn’t officially a Zen Buddhist, but he really loved this type of philosophy. And he created a piece of music called Four Minutes 33. And what happens is the whole orchestra will go on stage and they will sit there and play nothing for four minutes and 33 seconds. So the audience literally have to sit there and listen to the ambient sound of the concert hall or wherever it’s being performed. And he was very sneaky because he was encouraging people to meditate, maybe without them realizing that they were doing it. And it’s all done through, your ears and listening very closely to the ambient sound. And this was a huge thing to do, quite revolutionary at the time when you put it out. And we can have a go at doing it very easily by setting a timer for four minutes and 33 seconds. But there are wonderful videos if you search for John Cage, four minutes, 33 on YouTube, you can see big concert halls filled with thousands of people all just listening to silence. And this was his way of connecting to Zen. And I absolutely love this as a concept.
Brett McKay: No, it sounds like a lot of fun. I’m gonna have to give that a try. So set a timer for four minutes and 33 seconds. And you can do this in different places. You can do this at home in nature, downtown, and then just spend that time focusing your thoughts, like letting your mind be still and paying close attention to the sounds and the environment. Okay. So the big thing you took from Zen is meditation and the different variations of it you’ve talked about. Are there any other practices or challenges inspired by Buddhism that you recommend?
Ben Aldridge: Another tool that I think is, really useful from Buddhism, it’s this idea of impermanence. And I really like this idea. So the idea is that everything around us is changing. We know that just by observing the world around us. And this is very helpful because if we’re going through a tough time, we can really hold onto the fact that it will change. Everything is constantly moving and evolving so we can focus on the other side of difficulty. So for instance, if I have to go to the dentist for something to get a filling, whatever, and I know that I’m not gonna enjoy that process. However, I know that it’s a temporary experience and I can try to project my mind to the other side of the experience and know that it’s all changing and I will be through this. And this takes away maybe the, weight of that situation.
It helps to lighten it. So same if you are in traffic, you’re not gonna be in traffic forever. So focus on the fact that things are always changing and always moving. Now the other side of this is very powerful because we can use it when we’re going through something amazing. So say you’re having a beautiful moment with the family or something, you’re doing something that you are really enjoying, you can also remember that this is impermanent and it will change. And that can help us to savor those moments even more. So it’s funny how there’s two sides to this, this coin of impermanence, but I think being able to use that and hold onto that when we’re going through experiences in life can be very helpful.
Brett McKay: Yeah. One practice you recommend is intentionally being bored. Why is that a good way to practice Buddhist ideas of impermanence?
Ben Aldridge: Yeah, so that’s a great way of tapping into this idea of, sitting with the mind. So that’s, I wouldn’t say that boredom is like a practice that Buddhists would do, but it’s one of the challenges in the book that I encourage people to do because it’s a way to train the mind and to sort of sit with the mind itself and try and understand how you think about things. So a great way to do this is to put yourself in a situation where you are doing something that you really will find boring. Like watching a movie that’s just terrible that you really don’t wanna watch or listening to a song you really don’t like, or trying a genre of music that you really hate and just paying attention to the mind when you are doing that. It’s a great way of highlighting what’s going on in between your ears. It’s a nice way of, trying to sort of understand yourself better and putting yourself in these boring situations is good as well because then when you actually have to encounter a boring situation, you’re a little bit trained and you can kind of frame it as training as well.
Brett McKay: Have you heard about this, this trend that’s happening online of dudes? They’ll get on a flight that’s like a seven hour flight and they’ll just stare. They won’t look at their phone, they won’t, they’ll, they’ll stare at like the, maybe there’s a screen in front of them, the flight path. They call it raw dogging, which has that, sexual innuendo. But there’s this whole, it’s, I don’t know if you’ve seen this, it’s kind of funny.
Ben Aldridge: Yeah, I have seen it. Yeah, they’re essentially doing a meditation, like quite an extreme Yeah. Version of that where they’re, they’re actually going in for this like, almost like a meditation retreat that just sat there and just focusing on just yeah, being present. I don’t know whether there’s the philosophical intention behind it, whether it’s just supposed to be kind of a funny thing. But actually it’s amazing. Yeah. If you look at it like that, if you see it as a philosophical practice, yeah, that’s this pretty impressive.
Brett McKay: Though I incorporate bored in my life is whenever I’m standing in line for something or waiting at the doctor’s office instead of checking my phone, I’ll just sit there and just be bored. And it’s a challenge ’cause you have that itch to want to check your phone and distract yourself. But I try to exercise my willpower and just be with my board feelings because usually it passes after a few minutes. Another philosophy you look at is cynicism. This is another ancient Greek philosophy. What’s the story of the cynics?
Ben Aldridge: So the cynics are very different. They’re a great bunch of, ancient folk who used to do some wild things in the name of philosophy. Now there aren’t actually that many cynics today, but the word cynic now has a slightly negative connotation, kind of implies someone who’s overly skeptical in a negative way. But it actually, the original cynicism comes from kynikos, this ancient Greek word, which means dog-like, and it was meant as a derogatory thing towards the cynics because they used to live like wild dogs and they would choose to live a life of homelessness out of a way to practice their philosophy. And the philosophy is all about being able to build resilience and also be detached from the state. They were very open about freedom of speech. This was one of the cornerstones of cynic philosophy. In fact, the four cornerstones of cynicism, the first one is freedom of speech.
And the famous cynic Diogenes said that freedom of speech is the most beautiful thing in the world. Now that was really important to them. And the other three cornerstones, we’ve got endurance. So you’ve gotta be tough to be a cynic. There’s, this practice called Asceticis where they would deliberately do difficult things to build resilience. And then finally there’s self-sufficiency, which is where they’re able to look after their selves and not have to rely on the states or rely on anyone else. And this was important to them because they felt that freedom of speech could only really happen if you were not kind of dependent on a state for any money or for worrying about your reputation. So being outside of the system in a way allowed them to sort of criticize it and openly look and, discuss ancient society. So they’re really fascinating philosophers and I’m particularly interested in their practical resilience building that Asceticis training, which they used to do. And they did some very funny things in the name of self-improvement.
Brett McKay: Oh yeah, so this Asceticis training. So Diogenes, he famously lived in like a barrel, basically a tub. Didn’t bathe, urinated, like just defecated in public. Just a weird guy. And like, there’s that famous story of Alexander the Great went to go meet Diogenes and Diogenes told this guy who basically thought he was God on earth, hey, get out of my way, you’re standing in front of my son. And Alexander, he respected that. He was like, man, this guy. This guy’s awesome. He has no master. He’s his own master.
Ben Aldridge: Yeah, exactly. And I love that. Someone, I can’t remember who it was, but we were talking about the cynics and they described them as the trolls of ancient Athens. And I thought that was hilarious because a lot of them would do these things to provoke big reactions from society. The theatres would empty at the end of a performance and hundreds of people would go out onto the streets and the cynics would be there deliberately walking in the wrong direction, getting in the way. And that is really what a lot of the cynic philosophy is about. It’s really challenging conventions and really making people question the way that they’re living their lives. So they’re a great bunch.
Brett McKay: So I don’t think you’re not advocating that people stop bathing and start urinating in public, but what can we take away from the cynics and what are some practices we can do to incorporate that into our lives?
Ben Aldridge: Yeah, absolutely not. I think that this is probably why people enjoy stoicism. Maybe it’s a bit more palatable and stoicism actually sort of came from the cynics but yeah in terms of practical application of the cynics what we’re looking for is this Asceticis training so finding things that make us a little bit uncomfortable we don’t have to go too far with it but one of the exercises that I love that’s very ridiculous but it’s inspired by the cynics is called the banana walk and it’s basically embarrassing yourself in public so there was a man called Albert Ellis and he created modern therapy called REBT, Rational Emotive Behavior Therapy. And this was based on how, well, a lot of the ideas in this therapy were based on how the cynics would deliberately do embarrassing things and do things to challenge society. So he created this thing called the banana walk, which is where you take a banana, you tie a piece of string to it, and then you go for a walk in a busy public place. And people will stare at you and you’ll feel embarrassed. And you have to work through a lot of things going in your head. And I can say, honestly, I’ve done this myself. I’ve walked bananas in London, carrots in Paris, all on string, feeling very silly about the whole situation.
But it’s amazing what happens within the mind. And this is what Albert Ellis was encouraging people to do, to really challenge that internal dialogue. Why are we embarrassed? And the more you do it, the more comfortable you become in your own skin. And Diogenes, this cynic we were talking about, he used to drag a bottle of wine on a piece of string through the Agora, the ancient marketplace in Athens. So there’s a direct tie to this modern practice of walking bananas in public. And you know what, if you go to the Albert Ellis Institute in New York, you’ll often see people walking bananas on string outside the building as a way to basically build resilience and build self-confidence and to not get so caught up in how other people are thinking about us. So it’s a lovely practice. And yeah, I always try and encourage people to connect to this ancient art of doing embarrassing things in the name of self-improvement.
Brett McKay: Yeah. It sounds like it’s a form of exposure therapy. You have this anxiety that people are gonna think of you poorly, but then you just do these things where you put yourself in situations where you think people are gonna be thinking bad about you. And then you kind of get a nerd to it. Any other things besides walking a banana you can do to embarrass yourself?
Ben Aldridge: For sure. Yeah, there’s tons. When I became a dad about three years ago, and someone gave me a book of dad jokes, and they’re all terrible. They’re just awful jokes. So I’ve been testing them out on strangers. And if you stop people in London during rush hour to tell them a bad joke, it’s going to go down like a lead balloon. And it’s honestly so embarrassing for me and for anyone that I stop to tell them this terrible joke. But in the process, is learning to sit with that discomfort, that mental discomfort. So that’s one thing that I’ve been doing. People could announce the next stop on the train out loud. They can sing out loud while they’re walking down the street. It’s all about embarrassing yourself. There’s a great show in the US, actually. It’s called Impractical Jokers.
Brett McKay: Oh, yeah.
Ben Aldridge: I’m not sure if you know.
Brett McKay: Yeah.
Ben Aldridge: So basically, this concept is called shame attacking. And Albert Ellis is a big fan of shame attacking. And there’s even a shame attacking championships where people have to try and outdo each other by doing embarrassing things in public. But the key is to make sure it’s about you being embarrassed, not trying to embarrass other people. So it’s a personal development thing, but it’s pretty funny when you unpack it a bit.
Brett McKay: We’re gonna take a quick break for a word from our sponsors. And now back to the show. So the next philosophy you look at in the book is Daoism. For those who aren’t familiar with Daoism, what are its main ideas?
Ben Aldridge: So this is an ancient Chinese philosophy, and it’s very practical. In a way, it became a religion as it evolved, and it became a semi-official religion for China at one point. And some people view it as a philosophy, others view it as a religion. So there’s a mix. And it’s all down to interpretation. It’s very practical. And the main purpose, again, is to lock into this idea of building a good life and flourishing. And for the Daoists, there’s a real connection to nature and using nature and building that relationship with the natural world around us. In fact, the way that they learnt about the universe was through observation of the natural world and we can see this because the taoists created the hang glider and they created it as a way to understand the natural laws of the world around them in the Chinese mountains. So observing nature connecting to nature there’s also a well-being side of Daoism things like tai chi and qi gong where you are basically performing movements and breath work and all of this can help us to kind of cultivate well-being. So there’s loads of ideas. I’m really simplifying here and hitting the top line, of course, because all of these philosophies are so detailed.
But for me, the key thing that I connect to with Daoism is this relationship with nature and also trying to understand ourselves, our intuition as well. This is a big thing. There’s a lot of talk about one of my favorite ideas in Daoism is this concept called Wuwei, which is where you go with the flow and you kind of emulate nature so when water is confronted by a rock it will go around it will work with the obstacle and if you look at Bruce Lee and how he used to use his opponent’s strength against them it was kind of very sort of yielding in the way that he would work and there’s lots of quotes that are very Daoist in nature that you’ll see if you’re a fan of Bruce Lee’s work so there’s a lot going on with Daoism but yeah for me I love that connection to nature that’s something that I found is very practical getting out into the the natural world.
Brett McKay: Yeah we did a whole podcast a long time ago about Daoism and about wuwei and I think about this book all the time it’s called Trying Not to Try, did you come across that during your…
Ben Aldridge: No I haven’t come across it no.
Brett McKay: Yeah so the guy his name was Edward Slingerland and he wrote it was an introduction to Daoism but yeah that wuwei the translation that he proposed it’s like effortless action. Like you were trying to go in with the flow, like you just do something and you do it awesomely, but it feels effortless. So I think all of us have experienced that moment where we’re in that flow state. And so Daoism was all about trying to get into that wuwei state. And there’s different camps in Daoism, just like there was different camps in Buddhism. And one camp thought that you could achieve wuwei, this effortless action by practicing a lot and like doing things over and over again until it became effortless. And then some people thought, well, no, that’s actually, you’re trying too hard to achieve that effortless state needed to kind of achieve it through this sort of not even trying to try state. But yeah, I think the whole idea is that you wanna achieve this ability to do things without having to exert much effort. And one of the practices you recommend to help you achieve that is going on a wuwei adventure. So what’s a wuwei adventure?
Ben Aldridge: Yeah, I love this as an idea. So basically, it’s just learning to tap into your intuition a little bit and just going with the flow. So a classic example would be, let’s say you rock up to a new city, and you’ve got a general sense of where you are. But it’s almost like not relying on the maps and everything, like the itinerary that you’ve put together. It’s just going with the flow and trying to trust your intuition and explore in a very open way and seeing what happens. When I was younger, I went on a trip around Europe where you can buy these things called interrail tickets, where you basically have a ticket on every train. So you can go wherever you want, whenever you want, and you just float around. And it was just before I went to university and there was something amazing about not knowing where you were going to be the next day and knowing what necessarily where you’re gonna be sleeping and kind of tapping into that, going with the flow, seeing what happens. If you’re enjoying a place, you spend more time there. If not, you move on. And you’re just learning to be a little bit more intuitive in how you’re living. Now, obviously, the disclaimer is, try and do it in a safe manner and don’t do anything silly, but it’s a nice way of connecting to our intuition and learning to just kind of be a bit more open to whatever it is that we might encounter in the real world.
Brett McKay: Yeah. And the other practice you recommend just spending more time out in nature and you can combine a Wuwei adventure with nature time. Maybe you go to a state park or a national park and just see where things take you. And again, you got to be safe about this. You don’t wanna do anything dumb that will get you injured or killed. But yeah, spend time in nature, do things spontaneously, add some serendipity in your life. In your previous book, we mentioned this earlier, How to be Comfortable with Being Uncomfortable, it’s inspired by Stoicism. So it’s no surprise that you included Stoicism in Seriously Happy. I think most of our listeners are familiar with Stoic philosophy, but for those who aren’t, give us a thumbnail sketch of its big ideas.
Ben Aldridge: Yeah, for sure. So Stoicism is very similar in the sense that it’s trying to achieve eudaimonia. It’s trying to create a life that flows well. And they’re all about tapping into the cardinal virtues, which are these kind of virtues and quality of character that they believed everyone should strive towards. So we’ve got courage, justice, wisdom, and self-discipline or temperance. And if we can lock into those, then the Stoics believe that ultimately we could live a better life. But there’s tons of ideas within Stoic philosophy. And I found it particularly helpful for me when I was in my mid 20s. That’s when I discovered it off the back of really bad anxiety and I found that a lot of the ideas really spoke to me particularly the idea of building resilience by stepping outside of your comfort zone and doing difficult things in the name of self-improvement that really changed my life and it’s interesting because the more I learned so I started with stoicism that’s how I got into philosophy the more I started studying that the more I realized that it was actually the cynics who taught the stoics this idea.
So some of these ideas that Diogenes did sort of filtered down to the Stoics. And I really like where those two philosophies meet, because I think Stoicism is not as extreme as Cynicism and that’s why I think a lot of people have really connected to it and resonated with it, because it’s something that you don’t need to give away all your possessions to be a Stoic. You can still connect to this idea and it’s highly practical. So yeah, I love it and I continue to use it in my life. But obviously I like to dabble in other philosophy as well. It’s nice to pick ideas and use certain bits that resonate with you.
Brett McKay: So what are some practices that people can do to incorporate stoicism into their life?
Ben Aldridge: Yeah. So I think one of the practices that I really like is this idea of sympatheia. And it’s one of these things that there’s a guy called Heracles who created this diagram. It’s basically imagine concentric circles and in the center is you. And then in the next circle is family the next one is friends the next one is neighbors and then it goes on and out towards everyone in the country et cetera and the goal of sympatheia is to be able to bring everyone closer to the center so that you’re treating friends like family and neighbors like friends you’re being very open and kind in society and you’re trying to be a good part of society and help basically make the world a better place. And it was just a nice way of sort of framing it. And when you see the diagram, it’s quite interesting. And the process of this is called oikeiosis, of bringing people closer to you to spread this kindness and this sympatheia. So I really like that idea. And it’s just being nice to people, isn’t it? It’s just spreading kindness. And that’s something that I think the world definitely needs. And small random acts of kindness is a great way of actually practically doing this.
Brett McKay: Yeah, you spend a lot of time talking about how stoicism can help you with your social life. Because the Stoics thought a lot about this. They realized that a lot of our vexations in life are often caused by other people or us thinking it’s being caused by other people. I think Marcus Aurelius had that line where it’s like, hey, just realize that there’s gonna be people today when you go out there. They’re gonna be annoying, but you can’t let that get to you. So, you mentioned the sympatheia thing where you think about everyone could be someone you can help out, but any practices that people can incorporate in their lives so that they’re not as annoyed by people as they typically are?
Ben Aldridge: Yeah. So I think a great thing to do is if someone is challenging, let’s put it that way, or if someone is really horrible to you, the way that you can frame that in a practical way is to switch it around and see it as a test of your character. You’re not trying to control that person. You have to accept that they’re outside of your control what you’re trying to do is focus on your response to them so the key idea in stoicism is it’s not what happens to you but how you respond and this was an epictetus quote but it’s really like the Golden rule in Stoicism. It’s about how we deal with things that are in and outside of our control and how other people are to us when they’re unpleasant. That’s not really within our control. So it’s up to us to respond well to these challenges. And if we see it as a test of our character, this is really tapping back into that eudaimonia vibe where we’re trying to build character and we see it as a test. We frame it as a test and suddenly it’s about us now and how are we gonna deal with it. It’s not about this other person as being horrible. It’s like, okay, we accept that that’s going to happen in life. We’re gonna encounter difficult people. What do we do about it? So flipping it around like this is actually really powerful. I do this all the time when I’m dealing with people who are a little bit challenging.
Brett McKay: Yeah. You can almost make a game out of it. Okay, just how calm and collected can I stay in the face of this annoying person? Because I mean, it’s actually kind of fun to see someone who’s flipping out on you get more worked up because they’re bugged that you’re not affected by their diatribe. And you can do this with your kids too, like make it a game, how unaffected and calm you can stay when they’re having one of their meltdowns. And besides seeing it as a test of character as to how unaffected you can be by other people and circumstances, you also recommend just doing things that make you uncomfortable. So like you said, the Stoics are a less extreme version of cynicism. So they did things like sleep on the ground, wear a shabby looking tunic, take cold baths. So you can do something similar like that to get outside of your comfort zone and build up some stoic resilience. You’ve also included a competing philosophy of stoicism in your book, Epicureanism. What’s its story?
Ben Aldridge: So this is a fascinating philosophy and Epicurus created a school of philosophy in Athens called The Garden. And it was like a community, more like a retirement home, I guess. And the purpose of this was, well, the purpose of Epicurus’philosophy was to enjoy life. That’s what he felt was the important thing. Life is there to be enjoyed. And it’s really interesting because when people hear that, they will often think that that’s hedonistic and that he was this real party guy and everything was just in excess. But that’s the biggest misconception about Epicurus and his philosophy. In reality, he found that too much excess would actually lead to unhappiness or discomfort and his philosophy is all about trying to live a life where it’s not uncomfortable. So if you’re partying all the time it’s gonna catch up with you you’re gonna get the fallout from the partying that’s actually not he sort of valued not feeling like that higher than he felt he didn’t want to feel bad so in a way trying to avoid that made it easier. If that makes sense.
Brett McKay: No, that makes sense. So I think I’ve heard that when they look at pleasure, feeling good, they’re not just looking at it in the short term. They’re looking at it also in the longterm.
Ben Aldridge: Yeah, that’s it. Exactly, yeah. So that was really the driving philosophy is how to enjoy life. And he sort of discovered that simple pleasures were really the way to connect with this. And the food in Epicurus’s Garden was very basic, boiled lentils and a lot of their vegetables were homegrown and it was minimal in a way. And I think he’s trying to encourage people to really appreciate the simple things in life because it’s easier to achieve that as well. For instance, on a very hot day when you have a glass of cold water, it’s incredibly satisfying and there’s something really rewarding about that. You don’t need the complexity of different juices and different tastes. Actually appreciating the simple things in life was a great way of learning to be more appreciative of everything. And that’s really what Epicurus talks about. So it’s a great philosophy.
Brett McKay: Yeah. So some of the challenges you have eat simpler food and learn how to savor it. So when you’re eating your lentil soup, it’s like, Hey, I’m gonna just really be with this. It can become a meditative practice almost. How does this feel in my mouth? What does it taste like? And then you also recommend only drinking water for a week or a month. Another way to practice Epicureanism.
Ben Aldridge: Yeah, that’s right. So in the garden water was the main drink. That was a big part of it. So yeah, we’re really trying to emulate that. And it’s also just a bit of self-control moderation. Can you handle not having coffee and tea or whatever throughout the day? How does that feel? Are you able to be in control? Is this idea of moderation really comes in. And Epicurus encourages moderation. Because that’s ultimately cuts off these like peaks of dopamine hits and kind of highs and lows. So yeah, it’s trying to find things that help us to appreciate the small things in life.
Brett McKay: Yeah. Another challenge you recommend inspired by Epicureanism is taking a digital fast. What does that look like? And have you done these in the past?
Ben Aldridge: Oh yeah, for sure. Like, I do this a lot. I’ve find I just put the phone away and try and do as long as possible. It normally coincides with being away on holiday because I find that that’s actually a practical time to do it. But it is amazing how connected we are and dependent we are on this tech. I often feel that the first few days are quite challenging, a little bit twitchy and edgy, just thinking, oh, what’s in the inbox? What’s happening? And it takes a little bit of time for the mind to be okay with that. So actually that to me is a real indicator that there’s value in doing this. And interestingly, Epicurus encouraged the people who lived in the garden to not engage with kind of political scandals and the kind of politics of the day. In a way it was a bit head in the sand and it was like, you come to the garden and you’re gonna disconnect a little bit. You don’t have to be up to date, you don’t have to be following what’s going on. You can just disconnect a little bit. So really that’s a modern way of doing that, is by cutting ourselves off from the tech that we are so dependent on. And it also highlights our relationship to that, so there’s definitely value in being able to take some time away from it. I think it’s really useful.
Brett McKay: Yes. Take a break from Twitter, take a break from Reddit, Daily Mail, if that’s your vice, checking the news. Just don’t watch, don’t look at that stuff for a month.
Ben Aldridge: Yeah, exactly. And I think you’re not gonna miss anything. It’s almost impossible to miss anything big nowadays because someone’s gonna talk to you about it and you are gonna hear about it. So you don’t need to be following every story, every breaking story. Now every news story is breaking news, really. So there’s value in kind of stepping back from it. I think the same with social media as well. We can get really caught up with social media and it’s hard because it is addictive. It’s designed to be addictive as well. So if adults find it hard, teenagers are gonna find it really hard as well. So I think there’s so much value in trying to understand our relationship with all of this tech and being able to kind of get some kind of control over it. And the digital fasts are a good start towards that. ’cause It highlights our dependence, day one you’re gonna feel it. And actually that’s good because then it makes you realize how dependent you are on this. And obviously not everyone, but I find sort of generally when we look around us, most people are addicted to their phones.
Brett McKay: I’m a big fan of Aristotle, so I was happy to see that he ended up in your book. Aristotle wrote about a lot of different things. What part of Aristotelianism did you focus on for your book Seriously Happy?
Ben Aldridge: Yeah. So I mean, he’s contributed so much to the western thought and philosophy in general, but in Seriously Happy, I wanted a really practical thing that people could connect with and use. So his decision making method, his model for making decisions is absolutely brilliant. And I use this a lot. So I wanted to share this, this is really the main thing that we drill down on in the book, so I’d like to go through it with you.
Brett McKay: Yeah, it’d be great.
Ben Aldridge: And well, I’ll give you the sort of top line, but basically this is good for big decisions in life. Not necessarily when you’re in the coffee shop trying to decide what to drink or what you have in for lunch. This is more of a big life decision. So the first step is to ensure that you have the space to actually process your decision.
Give yourself time to think about what this means. So don’t rush it. The second thing is make sure you are in the right mental state. So obviously if you’re drunk, you’re not gonna be thinking clearly. If you are overly emotional, if you are really stressed, if you are really tired, all of these things can impact your decision. So you want to be in a good mental space when you are making your decision. Then you want to look at all the facts involved. So for some people, they’re gonna use a spreadsheet maybe, and they’ll be very meticulous with it. But it’s really just making sure that you’ve considered everything. Try and get everything in one place so that you can kind of process it. Then you would consult an expert. And I don’t think we should have blind faith in experts, but at the same time, if you wanted to learn the piano, you would probably wanna talk to someone who can play the piano.
So there’s value in speaking to people who have gone through what you’re going through or who can actually advise in a good way. So then you want to think about family and friends and all the people that this decision will impact. Is it going to have an effect on their lives? What’s it gonna do for them? So if you, for instance, if you’re moving, how’s this gonna affect your family and all the people around you in your life? So that’s the next step. Then you want to look at history so you can start mining your own history in your life to see if you’ve had to make a decision like this before, if so, how did it go? What did you learn? But you can also think bigger picture, look historically, see if anyone else has had to make a similar decision and how did it work? What lessons can we learn from that?
And then the final two steps is to be quite mathematical. What’s the probability of the… What kind of outcomes are you gonna get and what’s the probability of each one? So that’s a really important thing to think. Okay, is this gonna happen if I make this decision, what, X, Y, Z, what’s gonna happen? And then finally you can think about how luck would play into that decision. So if you get green lights on everything and it goes really well, what’s gonna happen? What could be at the end of that decision? And also what could happen if everything goes wrong, if you get red lights and it all goes in pet shaped. So considering all of those things, Aristotle believed that you would be fully prepared to make a big life decision. And I love that. I think it’s a really practical tool.
Brett McKay: Yeah, that’s, I think it goes to his idea of practical wisdom or phronesis, it’s just how to figure out what the right thing to do at the right time for the right reasons. And you have to make these decisions all the time. And the process that you laid out can help people develop that practical wisdom so that whenever, so they can reach a point where they don’t have to actually go through that process, it kind of becomes intuitive. It becomes like almost wuwei like. You just, based on your experience of making these decisions over and over again, going through that process, you fine tune your ability to make decisions.
Ben Aldridge: Absolutely. And I think you will get better at doing it the more you do it, but I think sometimes when you have a big decision, a really big decision, sometimes mulling it over in depth like this and having a system and a method that you can actually work through, I find that is really helpful and you can really just take your time to work through it. And yeah, I think that is very valuable.
Brett McKay: And as you said, this book’s geared towards young people. So young people like teenagers, they’re going through a period of their life where they’re making some really big important decisions where they’re gonna go to college who they should marry, what they should do for a career. So this process can help with that. So if you’re a parent, it’s another tool you can give them to help them make these important decisions.
Ben Aldridge: Yeah, for sure. And it’s a tough time, when you’re a teenager, there’s a lot going on and you’ve got powerful emotions and trying to manage all of that, making decisions that are sound. So yeah, it’s hard. And I think having some kind of framework is super useful. So I think this method is good.
Brett McKay: And you also challenge people or recommend people or young people, I think anybody as well is just to make more decisions. A lot of people, they take a very passive approach to life, just like, I just don’t care. Oh, where do you want to go to lunch? Oh, whatever you want. And so because you’re constantly passing the buck, they don’t have the ability to make decisions when it matters. So one recommendation you have is just to start making more decisions, even over like the small dumb things like what you want to eat for lunch or what movie you wanna watch.
Ben Aldridge: Yeah, definitely. That’s a great tool as well. And yeah, what do you wanna watch? Rather than just go, I don’t care. You actually just make a decision, just do it. And also don’t worry if it’s the wrong decision. I think people get really hung up on that, oh, I’m, what if I make a mistake? What if I decide something that doesn’t work out? Well that’s the part that we need to get comfortable with and just learn that yes, sometimes our decisions aren’t gonna be perfect, but the more we do it, the more we learn to trust ourselves and just know that everything is all right and we can work through whatever happens. So yeah, just being more decisive, it’s a good thing to do. I think everyone can tap into that.
Brett McKay: And I think also making decisions helps you figure out who you are. I think a lot of young people, I think even you can say adults go through this, like, I don’t know, who am I? Like what am I about? Making decisions forces you to actually think about what you’re about and who you are.
Ben Aldridge: Yeah, exactly. And knowing that, yeah, sometimes the wrong decision is actually great because it’s taught you something about yourself that maybe you didn’t know before and is highlighted. Yeah, that’s not the direction I want to take. So there’s value as long as you find value in everything you do, and always look for the lesson. That’s a really good way of framing decision making.
Brett McKay: Well, Ben, this has been a great conversation. Where can people go to learn more about the book and your work?
Ben Aldridge: Yeah, so the Best Places is my website, benaldridge.com. And there’s links to social media. There’s pictures from all the philosophy challenges and bits to my books and stuff. We’ve got an educator’s guide on there. So this Seriously Happy book that’s coming out in September has this PDF that we’ve created with the publishers. And it’s basically starting discussions in classrooms and people who are educators and parents can use this as a way to really drill down on some of the content within the book. So yeah, the website is the best place to go.
Brett McKay: Fantastic. Well, Ben Aldridge, thanks for your time. It’s been a pleasure.
Ben Aldridge: Thank you so much for having me back. Great to be here and chatting to you.
Brett McKay: My guest today is Ben Aldridge. He’s the author of the book, Seriously Happy, it’s available on amazon.com. You find more information about his work at his website, benaldridge.com. Also, check out our show notes at aom.is/seriouslyhappy. We find links to resources, we delve deeper into this topic.
Well, that wraps up another edition of the AOM podcast. Make sure to check out our website @artofmanliness.com where you find our podcast archives as well as thousands of articles that we’ve written over the years about pretty much anything you think of. And if you haven’t done so already, I’d appreciate take one minute to just read off a podcast or Spotify helps out a lot. And if you’ve done that already, thank you. Please consider sharing the show with a friend or family member who you think we get something out of it. As always, thank you for the continued support. Until next time is Brett McKay reminding to tell our listening AOM podcast, but put what you’ve heard into action.
