And where I live I found out that, sob stories aside, the servers actually make a min. wage of $8/hr. More than I made at the worst customer service jobs, without tips or complaining. So again, don’t feel sorry for them. And won’t give such ingrates any more money.

Moreover, percentages adjust to inflation, so why the hell do tip percentages keep going up? I’m glad I learned to cook before they simply expect, regardless, a quarter of the bill at Denny’s, since it’s apparently for the priviliged. For an unintentional look at the true unmasked loathesomeness of servers check out Oprah’s episode on “manners,” where politeness basically translated to sitting down and shutting up with servers, being their own personal cash register, accepting the crappiest table, taking whatever they gave you and liking it. You get the pic. But these little beggers don’t get anymore of my money.

And while tipping 50% at a waffle place sounds nice, it seems to give the servers an attitude about deserving that rate regularly. It is sort of like the way I can’t help but hate on those who propagate panhandling by giving the homeless their change. This makes it harder for the ordinary diners who go there specifically because they need to budget-which is why those places exist in the first place. Remember 10% was generous as recently as the 90s, now it is “unwelcome.”

Telling someone to get a higher paying job means that people on the very bottom of the socio-economic scale, mostly undocumented workers, will fill the service jobs and those of us who are educated with a good work ethic will go elsewhere to earn a living. This will bring down the overall experience and service you will get at a bar or restaurant. Now if you want a 5th grade drop-out who can’t communicate as your server or bartender then by all means, stop tipping and that’s what you’re going to get because thats the only person who will work for minimum wage. If you are satisfied with the level of service you get at McDonalds or Wallmart, but from a server or bartender instead, by all means, keep your money. Notice that these workers are unable to improvise, make recommendations, provide you with much information on the product, have in depth conversations with you on a wide array of topics, or do much of anything besides take your money in exchange for a product. They may be nice enough people, but little is required of them other than showing up (they are essentially wage slaves and this too must change).

Of course if everyone collectively decided not tip, then the money would need to be made up elsewhere, namely by wages which in turn would increase the price of the item being purchased. In Europe the workers wage is included in the price of the goods and services and accordingly everything costs more. European workers are covered by nationalized health care and additional forms of social programs which prevent even low end workers from falling into total destitution. In the U.S., if you don’t earn enough, you simply are allowed to die. That’s the bottom line. That is the reason why Europeans who don’t tip are treated rudely by U.S. service workers. In the U.S. if you try to unionize you are simply fired and the government will look the other way or the cops will beat you up, particularly if you try to unionize in a large corporation or chain where bribery and payoffs to local law enforcement or provocateurs is common. Not tipping for at least adequate service is, in effect, stealing wages from largely powerless people. The U.S. is not a place where the economy is not completely socially engineered. Theoretically, people are allowed to succeed or fail based on performance. Someone who excels in their profession expects to be paid more than someone who does not. Tipping is an expression of this principal. You don’t give everyone doing the same job the same wage, because this doesn’t encourage excellence or hard work. People will only work hard enough not to get fired and if all they get is minimum wage, how hard will that be? Again, only desperate people will fill a minimum wage job. In most cases, non-tippers will find it difficult to get business owners to reprimand or fire employees for bad service based solely on the complaints of the small number of people who don’t tip and therefore get poor service. If an employee is providing bad service to tippers and non-tippers alike, sales will eventually decline on that workers shift and they will be gone soon enough. Employers in the U.S. expect their staff to work hard but they also understand that there has to be some incentive for that hard work and they would rather ignore the 10% of you that don’t tip than fire an employee who is bringing in tons of cash from the other 90%. They also don’t want to pay higher wages which means if the employee is not making adequate money through tips, they will either ask for a raise, give away drinks to make up the difference, or steal. It’s a well known fact in the bar industry that many a bar-owner gathered together enough principal to buy a bar by stealing when they worked for someone else. Employees who are responsible, earn money for the owner, and are honest are hard to come by and most business owners know this. The chances of a customer getting an employee fired in the service industry is very slim. And why would you want to be the kind of person to get someone fired anyway? That’s someone’s life, and possibly the life of their children you are effecting just for not doing something that you are supposed to do anyway? Again if you are treated rudely by a server, better to just leave than try to get even. The server could be going through some personal problem or gotten some bad news and they were unable to get their shift covered which means if they don’t work, they could get fired. Rarely do people outside of the service industry get fired if they can’t show up because of an emergency or simply because they are sick.

If no one tipped service workers, then the decline in wages would ripple into the rest of the economy. i.e. If I don’t get tipped by Mr. X on a drink, I won’t be able to afford to buy a widget from Mr. Y later in the week. Now Mr. Y is short of cash and can’t afford to buy something from Mr. X. It’s like economic Karma. If you don’t give in this world, pretty soon it will come back to you.

I have an advanced degree. The truth is that bartending pays better than a lot of jobs you can get with a masters degree because 90% of the people out there know they are supposed to tip in the U.S. The 10% of you who don’t tip or tip poorly have any number of reasons that you don’t think you should, but the system isn’t going to change here because you are in such a small minority. This is the same excuse I hear from Europeans who don’t tip at home so they don’t think they have to tip here. When I go to a foreign country, I don’t want to offend the locals so I find out what the customs are and I follow them. If you want great service you have to pay for it. That doesn’t mean you have to tip bad service provided you even know how to identify it. The best way to proceed is to tip well up front, either the first time you go to a restaurant or the first round of drinks you order. If you receive bad service after that, tip less or go somewhere else. I promise you that any server who has held onto a prominent position in a bar or restaurant will take care of customers that tip well right from the start. If I get poor service after tipping well, I take my money elsewhere. But this never happens because servers are going to follow the basic free market principal of reciprocity and help whomever is helping them the most.

One way or another, a vibrant and exciting restaurant, nightclub, or bar scene requires happy and enthused servers. This depends upon people being well payed for their work either through tips or higher wages. One way or another you have to pay for the service. In America, the service is generally not included in the cost of food or liquor. This is the system that we have in place here and the 10% of you who don’t want to play along just appear cheap, ignorant, petty, or inexperienced. Since I deal with so many tourists from other countries, young people, amateurs, etc. I rely on regulars, other service workers, and people in the know for the bulk of my salary. These people are going to be treated better in the form of free drinks, information, feeling included, treated respectfully etc. Non-tippers will receive none of this and should not expect it. Again, you get what you pay for. And minimum wage doesn’t buy much. In closing, it’s much easier in the long run to get with the program and leave an appropriate tip for adequate service. Otherwise you are marked in an establishment by the staff and other patrons as someone who doesn’t know what they are doing or can’t afford to be there. If you are truly broke, leaving something is better than nothing, but generally, if you can’t afford to tip at least a little, you can’t afford to go out.

Suddenly my date is going to think I’m a cheap loser because I don’t tip 20%+? Maybe it’s a good idea to drop her, than, if she’s going to be that materialistic.

I think the problem stems from the fact that the people doing these service jobs tend to be greedy teenagers trying to suck money out of anyway they can so they turned this whole tipping thing in to a bullshit guilt trip. It’s not my responsibility to make sure people are making enough at their jobs to support themselves. I have my own job and my own responsibilities. At a restaurant, if I get good service I tip 15%. If it is anything less than good, I don’t leave anything. I don’t care how many tables they have, how busy they are, how behind the kitchen is. I’m going out to eat to forget about all those responsibilities. I may as well cook my own food at home if I was going to have to take on those responsibilities.

Your pizza delivery example only enforces my opinion in regards to the people performing these jobs are typically lower educated teenagers (not low educated because they’re idiots, just because they haven’t reached a higher level of schooling because of age). People should be doing a good job regardless. Not a revenge thing. If somebody was tipped poorly and they have to serve that same person at another time, don’t you think they should serve them BETTER than last time because apparently they didn’t do good enough job before. But instead, we have restauraunts full of people trying to spit in peoples food because they tipped poor last time. This just goes to show what type of people are working these service jobs. You’re low class if you spit in someones food. Period.

You seem to be confused with the concept of tipping. “Tipping ensures great service”. Whaaat?! It’s the other way around. Great service ensures tipping. If the service was great, it should be tipped. Not if they get a nice tip, respond with great service.

And tipping the take out person? Wow.

You’re forgetting that the service is ALREADY BEING PAID FOR. What did my original bill cover if my tip is also covering it? The bill is covering the service (which INCLUDES waitors waiting on customers), whereas the tip gives an extra little “thanks” if the work was GREAT, not good or sastisfactory.

There’s also a problem with service people thinking that if a person tips bad that the customer is a cheap ass. The service worker seems to be unable to figure out that the low tip was a representation of the service, not him being cheap.

This whole tip argument is annoying. You won’t find me tipping 20%+ for satisfactory service, and believe me, I’m not cheap. I just don’t find it necessary to give my money away to undeserving people. And if you give me nothing but normal service, expect to get normal pay (your salary without a tip from me).

The solution to this problem is that customers need to stop tipping for good/normal/satisfactory service and only tip for EXCELLENT service.

In my opinion, tipping has gotten out of hand (15-20 percent should be reserved for really good service, not standard). However, keeping in mind that most servers are underpaid with the assumption that tips will make the difference, and that they have to tip those who serve them, I understand that it’s a necessary evil.

And yes, I will bust my ass for chronically good tippers.

The service industry is just a few steps above slavery anyway and these folks that serve us, ad do it with a smile in a timely fashion, deserve a real living wage that unfortunately will not come through their paychecks.

Ride it like you stole it

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++ The whole tipping system is flawed and inefficient IMO. ++

It’s a good point — why should we tip people for doing their job?? I can see why you (and _many_ other people) would think that way. And, in some cases, I agree. The distinction comes down to exactly what you’ve recognized: Efficiency.

As a waiter for more years than I care to think about, I saw the way tipping can make a system more efficient (by which I mean, “better-operating” or providing a better experience for the customer.) I was very good at what I did — at making sure people were happy & had a pleasurable experience when they came into my restaurant. I made very good money by doing so, despite my base pay of only $2.13/hr.

Other waiters weren’t very good, especially when they were new. There wouldn’t have been much reason for them to improve, had tipping not been the standard.
It’s like being able to give yourself a raise — no begging the boss-man required.

However, the reason this works is because there is the potential for variance in the level of service the customer receives. In situations like car-washing, or tattooing/piercing, or — heck, I’ll go with it — nursing, when you connect the level of pay to the level of service, it makes things more fair. (Why should people have to pay the same price for poor service as for excellent service?! Why should crummy service people make the same as really hard-working service people?!)

In other cases — like the tip jar @ the cash register @ Subway, for instance — tipping is just absurd. There’s little difference between the sandwich you get when it’s made by a skillful, experienced “sandwich artist”, vs the, perhaps not quite as neatly-prepared sandwich you get when it’s made by the new guy. Sorry — no increase in “efficiency” (as I’ve used the term above) there.

@John Hooper ++ You Americans need to stop tipping as a substitute for pay. It’s a moronic condescending practice that you’re unfortunately exporting a masquerade for manners. There’s absolutely no reason to “tipâ€? someone for bringing you a plate of food.++

Another excellent point! When I was in Europe, I saw exactly what John was talking about — many of the waiters there (especially in the non-touristy areas) _did_ just “bring you a plate of food”. Hell, some of them didn’t even come by & refill my water! It was as though the customers were more of a nuisance than anything else; keeping the waitstaff from smoking cigarettes around back or something. I felt like telling some of them in advance, “hey, I’m going to give you a good tip. Just make sure I’m not dying of thirst over here!” Though I don’t know whether that would have helped.

I did have some customers who made me feel like I was begging for a living. But most of the time, I sincerely did enjoy making people happy. It’s not every job where you get to do that twenty or so times a night.

Shane