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	<title>Comments on: The Virtuous Life: Frugality</title>
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	<link>http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/</link>
	<description>Men&#039;s Interests and Lifestyle</description>
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		<title>By: Frugality and Software &#171; The Struggling Computer Science Student</title>
		<link>http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/comment-page-1/#comment-34452</link>
		<dc:creator>Frugality and Software &#171; The Struggling Computer Science Student</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 29 Jun 2009 21:15:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/#comment-34452</guid>
		<description>[...] students aren’t noted for their high disposable incomes. Therefore when trying to save some Benjamins, they often turn to free (as in beer) software, which is also often Free. And my tenure as an [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] students aren’t noted for their high disposable incomes. Therefore when trying to save some Benjamins, they often turn to free (as in beer) software, which is also often Free. And my tenure as an [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Donna</title>
		<link>http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/comment-page-1/#comment-20991</link>
		<dc:creator>Donna</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Jan 2009 04:43:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/#comment-20991</guid>
		<description>Hey - just wanted you to know that I stumbled across your site and really enjoyed this article and some others around here!

I posted about your site on my blog as well!
http://momsfrugal.blogspot.com/2009/01/frugality-for-men.html

Great job here! Love it! 
-I will look over your ebook and likely use it for my teen boys.
Blessings!
-Donna-</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey &#8211; just wanted you to know that I stumbled across your site and really enjoyed this article and some others around here!</p>
<p>I posted about your site on my blog as well!<br />
<a href="http://momsfrugal.blogspot.com/2009/01/frugality-for-men.html" rel="nofollow">http://momsfrugal.blogspot.com/2009/01/frugality-for-men.html</a></p>
<p>Great job here! Love it!<br />
-I will look over your ebook and likely use it for my teen boys.<br />
Blessings!<br />
-Donna-</p>
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		<title>By: hogan</title>
		<link>http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/comment-page-1/#comment-8352</link>
		<dc:creator>hogan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Jul 2008 06:31:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/#comment-8352</guid>
		<description>Hi,

Just wanted to send out a message about a website I created (www.finmind.com) for personal finance since it could help out people in this group.  I used to do all my finance stuff on Excel, but that was a pain because I had different versions floating around on different computers.

This website does stuff like track expenses, create a budget, etc.  If you want to give it a try, visit www.finmind.com.  It&#039;s free and I am not making any money off of it (no ads).  Send me any comments if you have feedback or suggestions.

Thanks,
Eugene</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi,</p>
<p>Just wanted to send out a message about a website I created (www.finmind.com) for personal finance since it could help out people in this group.  I used to do all my finance stuff on Excel, but that was a pain because I had different versions floating around on different computers.</p>
<p>This website does stuff like track expenses, create a budget, etc.  If you want to give it a try, visit <a href="http://www.finmind.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.finmind.com</a>.  It&#8217;s free and I am not making any money off of it (no ads).  Send me any comments if you have feedback or suggestions.</p>
<p>Thanks,<br />
Eugene</p>
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		<title>By: Eamonn Magrath</title>
		<link>http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/comment-page-1/#comment-5226</link>
		<dc:creator>Eamonn Magrath</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Jun 2008 21:36:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/#comment-5226</guid>
		<description>I have never saved. I will never save. I have nothing (in monetary terms). I have everything (in non-monetary terms) ... where am I going wrong?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have never saved. I will never save. I have nothing (in monetary terms). I have everything (in non-monetary terms) &#8230; where am I going wrong?</p>
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		<title>By: The Virtuous Life: Wrap Up &#124; The Art of Manliness</title>
		<link>http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/comment-page-1/#comment-4292</link>
		<dc:creator>The Virtuous Life: Wrap Up &#124; The Art of Manliness</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 02 Jun 2008 18:56:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/#comment-4292</guid>
		<description>[...] Frugality Make no expense but to do good to others or yourself; i.e., waste nothing. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Frugality Make no expense but to do good to others or yourself; i.e., waste nothing. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: virtuous</title>
		<link>http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/comment-page-1/#comment-3309</link>
		<dc:creator>virtuous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 May 2008 20:22:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/#comment-3309</guid>
		<description>[...] saying, &amp;quotWhat if I don&#039;t want to give up my daily Starbucks&amp;quot needs to be spayed/neutered.http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/The Virtuous Consumerdescription.http://www.virtuousconsumer.com/A Virtuous Woman in the Eyes of [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] saying, &#38;quotWhat if I don&#8217;t want to give up my daily Starbucks&#38;quot needs to be spayed/neutered.http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/The Virtuous Consumerdescription.http://www.virtuousconsumer.com/A Virtuous Woman in the Eyes of [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Brent Hodgson</title>
		<link>http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/comment-page-1/#comment-1956</link>
		<dc:creator>Brent Hodgson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Apr 2008 14:55:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/#comment-1956</guid>
		<description>Great post.

Recently here in Australia, employees of several financiers have complained that they are pressured to &quot;sell loans&quot; to people that can&#039;t afford to repay them.

Fortunately, savings here are (slightly) higher than in the USA.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Great post.</p>
<p>Recently here in Australia, employees of several financiers have complained that they are pressured to &#8220;sell loans&#8221; to people that can&#8217;t afford to repay them.</p>
<p>Fortunately, savings here are (slightly) higher than in the USA.</p>
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		<title>By: John Michailidis</title>
		<link>http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/comment-page-1/#comment-1868</link>
		<dc:creator>John Michailidis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Apr 2008 03:29:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/#comment-1868</guid>
		<description>I just stumbled upon your site and have found it to be a &quot;breath of fresh air.&quot;  With society&#039;s attempt at the emasculation of men, it&#039;s good to find a site that celebrates men and manhood.  Good job!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just stumbled upon your site and have found it to be a &#8220;breath of fresh air.&#8221;  With society&#8217;s attempt at the emasculation of men, it&#8217;s good to find a site that celebrates men and manhood.  Good job!</p>
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		<title>By: ' + title + ' - ' + basename(imgurl) + '(' + w + 'x' + h +')</title>
		<link>http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/comment-page-1/#comment-1851</link>
		<dc:creator>' + title + ' - ' + basename(imgurl) + '(' + w + 'x' + h +')</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 04 Apr 2008 13:55:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/#comment-1851</guid>
		<description>[...] Blogger friend Buck was kind enough to send us a link to this in an off-line yesterday, and today he&#8217;s got a post up about it: The Art of Manliness. His chosen feature? The Virtuous Life: Frugality. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Blogger friend Buck was kind enough to send us a link to this in an off-line yesterday, and today he&#8217;s got a post up about it: The Art of Manliness. His chosen feature? The Virtuous Life: Frugality. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: The Virtuous Life: Frugality &#124; vondarius</title>
		<link>http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/comment-page-1/#comment-1825</link>
		<dc:creator>The Virtuous Life: Frugality &#124; vondarius</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Apr 2008 15:09:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/#comment-1825</guid>
		<description>[...] read more [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] read more [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Rob O.</title>
		<link>http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/comment-page-1/#comment-1752</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob O.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Apr 2008 02:10:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/#comment-1752</guid>
		<description>Credit cards in themselves are not evil.  In fact, with the right card and some fierce determination, you can actualy make them work for you.  My wife &amp; I use our Citi Platinum Dividend card for virtually every purchase or payment we can so we can get the cashback dividends.  But we never - ever - carry a balance.  We behave as though it were one of those old-school AmEx cards that wouldn&#039;t even allow a balance to roll over from one month to another.

I truly do believe that debt is the freedom killer.  So many of our friends have rushed out and bought really prestigious newer homes that&#039;re beautiful, yet they&#039;re so far in debt with the mortgage that they can&#039;t afford a bucket of paint to change anything up.

Conversely, my wife &amp; I bought a dumpy, diamond in the rough, fixer-upper home in a decent, but far from upscale neighborhood.  12 years later, it&#039;s unrecognizable!  We&#039;ve redone every room (to some degree), including an extensive overhaul of the kitchen and one of the bathrooms.  We&#039;re planning to gut &amp; redo the master bath this Summer.  Point is, the house was very low priced so we&#039;ve been able to easily afford to do lots &amp; lots of upgrading to make it into a very nice home.  It&#039;s still quite modest-sized - and features none of the vaulted ceilings or other trappings of the new McMansions - but we love it!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Credit cards in themselves are not evil.  In fact, with the right card and some fierce determination, you can actualy make them work for you.  My wife &amp; I use our Citi Platinum Dividend card for virtually every purchase or payment we can so we can get the cashback dividends.  But we never &#8211; ever &#8211; carry a balance.  We behave as though it were one of those old-school AmEx cards that wouldn&#8217;t even allow a balance to roll over from one month to another.</p>
<p>I truly do believe that debt is the freedom killer.  So many of our friends have rushed out and bought really prestigious newer homes that&#8217;re beautiful, yet they&#8217;re so far in debt with the mortgage that they can&#8217;t afford a bucket of paint to change anything up.</p>
<p>Conversely, my wife &amp; I bought a dumpy, diamond in the rough, fixer-upper home in a decent, but far from upscale neighborhood.  12 years later, it&#8217;s unrecognizable!  We&#8217;ve redone every room (to some degree), including an extensive overhaul of the kitchen and one of the bathrooms.  We&#8217;re planning to gut &amp; redo the master bath this Summer.  Point is, the house was very low priced so we&#8217;ve been able to easily afford to do lots &amp; lots of upgrading to make it into a very nice home.  It&#8217;s still quite modest-sized &#8211; and features none of the vaulted ceilings or other trappings of the new McMansions &#8211; but we love it!</p>
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		<title>By: Parker Dutro</title>
		<link>http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/comment-page-1/#comment-1743</link>
		<dc:creator>Parker Dutro</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Apr 2008 06:06:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/#comment-1743</guid>
		<description>While some debt is unavoidable (if only temporarily) Bankruptcy whether resulting from sudden overwhelming medical expense or uncontrollable Starbucks addiction could be avoided in many cases by having 6 months to a year living expenses saved.  It takes more discipline than most of us own to put that kind of financial security together, but it is quite possible for anyone who commits to living within their means.  The problem is that we are not objective and honest when we discern what our means limit us to, and we therefore are more inclined to make lifestyle decisions that are beyond them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>While some debt is unavoidable (if only temporarily) Bankruptcy whether resulting from sudden overwhelming medical expense or uncontrollable Starbucks addiction could be avoided in many cases by having 6 months to a year living expenses saved.  It takes more discipline than most of us own to put that kind of financial security together, but it is quite possible for anyone who commits to living within their means.  The problem is that we are not objective and honest when we discern what our means limit us to, and we therefore are more inclined to make lifestyle decisions that are beyond them.</p>
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		<title>By: Rodney Hampton</title>
		<link>http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/comment-page-1/#comment-1742</link>
		<dc:creator>Rodney Hampton</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Apr 2008 04:17:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/#comment-1742</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m going to write in all caps because I think that everyone needs to get this through their head:  DEBT = SLAVERY

All of us are slaves to the banks.  Let that sink in.  Everything you see, pretty much, is not owned outright.  A lot of it has been purchased with consumer credit card debt, mortgages and second mortgages.  The boats, the cars, the SUVs, computers, playstations, and the houses are all being purchased on somewhere between 5% and 25% interest.  Very few people pay cash on the barrelhead these days.

I worked for a commercial bank for over 2 years.  Banks don&#039;t like to be undercollateralized.  They&#039;ll jack up your rate, cut down your access to credit, demand more collateral or interest when they think you&#039;re a risk.  God forbid you miss a payment or bounce a check.  If you don&#039;t have money, they&#039;ll charge you more!  Here&#039;s a particularly funny comedy routine about this ironic situation:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rpaCQKJpE9k

And, as we can see from the most recent economic news, the banks live by different economic rules than we do.  

There is no such thing as good debt.  You may think leverage is a good thing, as long as you&#039;re on the right side of the lever.  But conditions in the marketplace can change rapidly.  And -- unless you&#039;re like Donald Trump -- you won&#039;t be able to negotiate when your creditors come calling or it&#039;s time to face a margin call.

I&#039;m on a mission to pay back all of my debt within the next 20 years.  I may get lucky and get everything paid off in 10 if I transition from a well paying IT job into an even better paying job at a big law firm.  Most people aren&#039;t as lucky as me.

This consumer culture is sucking us dry.  The inflationary policies of the federal reserve are a disincentive on savings.  The concept that there is good debt flies in the face of centuries of human wisdom.  

Reject consumerism.  Take advantage of the 401k and, if you&#039;re lucky like me, the employer matching funds.  Invest in precious metals or foreign currencies like the Swiss Franc as a hedge against inflation.   Teach your kids that DEBT = SLAVERY.  Get off the grid.   Live frugally.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m going to write in all caps because I think that everyone needs to get this through their head:  DEBT = SLAVERY</p>
<p>All of us are slaves to the banks.  Let that sink in.  Everything you see, pretty much, is not owned outright.  A lot of it has been purchased with consumer credit card debt, mortgages and second mortgages.  The boats, the cars, the SUVs, computers, playstations, and the houses are all being purchased on somewhere between 5% and 25% interest.  Very few people pay cash on the barrelhead these days.</p>
<p>I worked for a commercial bank for over 2 years.  Banks don&#8217;t like to be undercollateralized.  They&#8217;ll jack up your rate, cut down your access to credit, demand more collateral or interest when they think you&#8217;re a risk.  God forbid you miss a payment or bounce a check.  If you don&#8217;t have money, they&#8217;ll charge you more!  Here&#8217;s a particularly funny comedy routine about this ironic situation:<br />
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rpaCQKJpE9k" rel="nofollow">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rpaCQKJpE9k</a></p>
<p>And, as we can see from the most recent economic news, the banks live by different economic rules than we do.  </p>
<p>There is no such thing as good debt.  You may think leverage is a good thing, as long as you&#8217;re on the right side of the lever.  But conditions in the marketplace can change rapidly.  And &#8212; unless you&#8217;re like Donald Trump &#8212; you won&#8217;t be able to negotiate when your creditors come calling or it&#8217;s time to face a margin call.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m on a mission to pay back all of my debt within the next 20 years.  I may get lucky and get everything paid off in 10 if I transition from a well paying IT job into an even better paying job at a big law firm.  Most people aren&#8217;t as lucky as me.</p>
<p>This consumer culture is sucking us dry.  The inflationary policies of the federal reserve are a disincentive on savings.  The concept that there is good debt flies in the face of centuries of human wisdom.  </p>
<p>Reject consumerism.  Take advantage of the 401k and, if you&#8217;re lucky like me, the employer matching funds.  Invest in precious metals or foreign currencies like the Swiss Franc as a hedge against inflation.   Teach your kids that DEBT = SLAVERY.  Get off the grid.   Live frugally.</p>
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		<title>By: Brett McKay</title>
		<link>http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/comment-page-1/#comment-1733</link>
		<dc:creator>Brett McKay</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 31 Mar 2008 22:42:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/#comment-1733</guid>
		<description>@Dan-

Good points. Some debt is inevitable and even helpful, but should be approached with discipline and self-restraint. 

Do you have a source for your statement that most bankruptcies are caused by medical expenses? During the summer I worked at the Dept. of Justice, the number of non-medical related bankruptcies were outweighed by those caused by poor financial choices. Of course that isn&#039;t a scientific sample, so I would be interested to know if there are any hard numbers out there.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@Dan-</p>
<p>Good points. Some debt is inevitable and even helpful, but should be approached with discipline and self-restraint. </p>
<p>Do you have a source for your statement that most bankruptcies are caused by medical expenses? During the summer I worked at the Dept. of Justice, the number of non-medical related bankruptcies were outweighed by those caused by poor financial choices. Of course that isn&#8217;t a scientific sample, so I would be interested to know if there are any hard numbers out there.</p>
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		<title>By: Dan</title>
		<link>http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/comment-page-1/#comment-1731</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 31 Mar 2008 21:43:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://artofmanliness.com/2008/03/30/the-virtuous-life-frugality/#comment-1731</guid>
		<description>The much publicized -1% Personal Savings Rate is a bit misleading.  It does not include 401K or IRA savings.  When you include those, the rate is still low, and declining, but it is not negative.  (I vaguely recall it being around 4.5%, but a quick Google failed to find the right number.)

I&#039;d also point out that not all debt is bad.  Borrowed money is not some evil, corruptible force.  Debt is just another tool.  One that can be used to great benefit, and even profit, if you possess true discipline and self-control.  

Also, unfortunately, some debt is unavoidable.  It isn&#039;t always about Grande Lattes or pimped out SUVs.  More people declare bankruptcy due to medical debt than any other reason.

The American economy is in a downturn, but be cautious of fluff statistics and sensational reporting making things look worse than they really are.  Things are rarely so one-sided or bleak.

Lastly, don&#039;t lose faith in your fellow Americans.  This nation has seen far greater challenges than this.  We will carry this burden, just like we always have.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The much publicized -1% Personal Savings Rate is a bit misleading.  It does not include 401K or IRA savings.  When you include those, the rate is still low, and declining, but it is not negative.  (I vaguely recall it being around 4.5%, but a quick Google failed to find the right number.)</p>
<p>I&#8217;d also point out that not all debt is bad.  Borrowed money is not some evil, corruptible force.  Debt is just another tool.  One that can be used to great benefit, and even profit, if you possess true discipline and self-control.  </p>
<p>Also, unfortunately, some debt is unavoidable.  It isn&#8217;t always about Grande Lattes or pimped out SUVs.  More people declare bankruptcy due to medical debt than any other reason.</p>
<p>The American economy is in a downturn, but be cautious of fluff statistics and sensational reporting making things look worse than they really are.  Things are rarely so one-sided or bleak.</p>
<p>Lastly, don&#8217;t lose faith in your fellow Americans.  This nation has seen far greater challenges than this.  We will carry this burden, just like we always have.</p>
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